Someone i can talk to?

[66stang347]

I have a few questions about time trials. Ive read over the rules but i was wondering if i could talk to someone possibly over the phone about some of the details. Anyone who is pretty familiar with the rules mind either shooting me a pm or posting up here that you wouldnt mind helping and ill send you my phone number. Thanks in advance.

[BoulderG]

Hi Aaron,
Happy to help however I can. I did the whole 2005 season, and some stuff before that (and going wayyyy back). Most recently, I ran a mild turbo Miata so if you have questions about car setup, I can certainly help with that.

Not sure how much the rules have changed.

I will say the Time Trials program is fantastic. Great all around. In fact, you'll end up spoiled for other events...

If you're near Boulder, let's meet in person - I'd enjoy seeing your car.
G-Man

[66stang347]

Ok i guess ill just post up in here for now and see how much i can get taked care of here. Thanks to all who sent me pms ill try to get in touch with yall if i cant get this all figured out. So heres a couple of my concerns:

It looks like for SM and SSM a cage is needed. Now i have a double diagonal roll bar which sadly i dont even know if that meets the requirements for a convertible let alone a car in those classes. Desregard all the tires in there its the only pic i could find that shows the bar clearly.
http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/504/cimg6278.jpg

Its a hard dog hardcore double diagonal roll bar. I sure hope it will work. And while we are on the subject of that how do they do measurements to see how low you need to be in relation to the roll bar? I remember seeing something that says your helmet needs to be 3" below the roll bar, how is that measured? I think im gonna need to put my Kirkey seat in there to make that cause im 6' so with a helmet on im pretty high up there.

Which will also bring me to another point. I saw in the rule book that i need to have the same seats/restraints on both sides of the car. So whatever is on the driver side is on the passenger side. How strict is that rule? Cause ive only got one racing seat for that car right now.

Ive only got 4 point harnesses right now will i need to upgrade those? I dont quite understand the rulebook on that one. It says you can use a 4 point harness if you have some other device that prevents you from submarining. I thought that would be a 5 or 6 point harness. What other anti submarine devices are there? Arm restraints wont be an issue for me cause i need them for rally anyways so thats taken care of.

It looks like im gonna need at least a fire extinguisher in the car too. I couldnt find the rules on where it needs to be mounted. Does it need to be within arms reach of the driver in the seat or can it be placed elsewhere?

And the last main thing is that i thought i remember seeing something that said SM and SSM cars need to have fuel cells. I cant find this anymore and i hope maybe my mind is just playing tricks on me. And i know i have a lot more questions so ill try to post them up as i think of them.

[BoulderG]

Aaron -
See if you're able to run in Open Street Prepared (OSP). That will solve a lot of your problems.

If you're six feet with stock seats, you likely won't clear the roll bar. I have some templates for mounting a Kirkey and I'm the same height.
Your roll bar is likely legal for TT and Solo 1. I believe the helmet rule is two inches below the roll bar, and it's a darn good idea.

You'll want a six-point harness. I wholly recommend a HANS or other Head&Neck Restraint (and I'm surprised SCCA doesn't require them yet).

Fire extinguisher can attach to roll bar or floor - use a metal bracket/clamp.

You'll want track pads (I like the Hawk Blues, but there are many options) and I recommend a set of dedicated track rotors (especially for the front). Not sure if your rally pads will work. You have track tires, I assume.

I believe SCCA Club Racing now allows SS, IT, and Spec Miatas to run with factory fuel tanks per the most recent FasTrak, if that matters.

Where are you located? Can you take the car to a shop that can do an SCCA Annual Tech? Most of those will have excellent advice on car setup, but won't know the TT classing or rules.

If you rally, do you know Dave Kern? He used to have a fast track Miata and would have excellent advice and possibly some parts leftover.

[jhadler]

It looks like for SM and SSM a cage is needed.

First off, you're asking about TT requirements, and mentioning GCR (road racing) classes. Consider looking into Solo classes. If the car is something that would qualify for SM, then consider it a DSP car.

The roll bar needs to clear the top of the helmet. It is strongly suggested that the roll bar provide 3" of clearance, but it is not required. Clearing the top of the helmet though is required.

Seats and restraints: The car has to have comparable restraints (that includes seats) for both the driver and instructor. That comes to the restraints, 4-point harnesses are legal provided that they carry SFI or FIA certification, and that they provide a mechanism to prevent submarining. For example, the Scroth ASM design meets this requirement. Keep in mind, at this point, there aren't many 4-point harness designs that actually meet these requirements.

Fire bottle is recommended, but not required.

Fuel cells are required for club racing cars, not TT.

Hope this answers some of your questions. Any more?

-Josh2

[GingerGSR]

Josh, that's Street Mod and Super Street Mod he's referring to. Not Spec Miata. His car has a supercharger so he runs in SSM in SOLO.

[GingerGSR]

Aaron, like Geremy said, see if you can run as OSP. Send Grant an e-mail detailing all the mods and safety equipment you have now. If your car isn't an 800 HP SSM MONSTER, then most likely they will let you run as OSP and therefore under those safety requirements. I was in the same boat when I got into TT. I got with David Walker at an AX and he looked at my car and then conferred with Grant & Josh and they let me run OSP. Mark Baer is now Chief of Tech.

Would it be possible to add a sub belt to your harness?

To measure your head room, use a stick or some other straight edge and lay it over the driver from the roll bar to the top of the windshield… known as the "broom stick method".

"Within reach of the driver" is the rule on the fire extinguisher. I mounted mine on the floor in front of the passenger seat. I used an aluminum plate that I bolted to the car then mounted the extinguisher to the plate. I've seen them on the roll bar or the dash too.

Some may disagree, but your extinguisher is to help put out someone elses car fire. Theirs is to help get yours put out. Your main mission is to get out and away from the car in an emergency and let the course workers do their thing. They have the training and equipment to deal with it the best.

[jhadler]

Josh, that's Street Mod and Super Street Mod he's referring to. Not Spec Miata. His car has a supercharger so he runs in SSM in SOLO.

Ahhh, that's different. Thanks for clearing that up for me. I saw SM and SSM, and thought "Spec Miata" and "Showroom Stock Miata".

-Josh2

[jhadler]

Some may disagree, but your extinguisher is help put out someone elses car fire. Theirs is to help get yours put out. Your main mission is to get out and away from the car in an emergency and let the course workers do they're thing. They have the training and equipment to deal with it the best.

Mark's on this one. A small fire bottle mounted in the car is not likely to put out anything more than a very small fire. Realistically, it's best use is to give you a couple extra seconds to get-the-heck-out. But that's only if it's easily accessible, and can be discharged from a harnessed position. Anything more than that, the corner workers and fire crew are far better equipped. Get the car stopped, and get out.

-Josh2

[66stang347]

Aaron -
See if you're able to run in Open Street Prepared (OSP). That will solve a lot of your problems.

If you're six feet with stock seats, you likely won't clear the roll bar. I have some templates for mounting a Kirkey and I'm the same height.
Your roll bar is likely legal for TT and Solo 1. I believe the helmet rule is two inches below the roll bar, and it's a darn good idea.

You'll want a six-point harness. I wholly recommend a HANS or other Head&Neck Restraint (and I'm surprised SCCA doesn't require them yet).

Fire extinguisher can attach to roll bar or floor - use a metal bracket/clamp.

You'll want track pads (I like the Hawk Blues, but there are many options) and I recommend a set of dedicated track rotors (especially for the front). Not sure if your rally pads will work. You have track tires, I assume.

I believe SCCA Club Racing now allows SS, IT, and Spec Miatas to run with factory fuel tanks per the most recent FasTrak, if that matters.

Where are you located? Can you take the car to a shop that can do an SCCA Annual Tech? Most of those will have excellent advice on car setup, but won't know the TT classing or rules.

If you rally, do you know Dave Kern? He used to have a fast track Miata and would have excellent advice and possibly some parts leftover.


Actually i know Dave and his Miata quite well. I kart with him and see him at all the CRC events. And his Miata now sits in my driveway :D

Lets see, i have a full fire suit and a huchens hybrid for head and neck protection. I was gonna wear it no matter what the rule was. I mean i would rather not mess with my own safety. What good is all that safety gear if its hanging in my closet while im out having fun at the track :confused:

I might hit you up for those mounting templates though. I have a pretty good idea on what i want to do but its nice to see what someone else has done that passed tech.

Aaron, like Geremy said, see if you can run as OSP. Send Grant an e-mail detailing all the mods and safety equipment you have now. If your car isn't an 800 HP SSM MONSTER, then most likely they will let you run as OSP and therefore under those safety requirements. I was in the same boat when I got into TT. I got with David Walker at an AX and he looked at my car and then conferred with Grant & Josh and they let me run OSP. Mark Baer is now Chief of Tech.

Would it be possible to add a sub belt to your harness?

To measure your head room, use a stick or some other straight edge and lay it over the driver from the roll bar to the top of the windshield… known as the "broom stick method".

"Within reach of the driver" is the rule on the fire extinguisher. I mounted mine on the floor in front of the passenger seat. I used an aluminum plate that I bolted to the car then mounted the extinguisher to the plate. I've seen them on the roll bar or the dash too.

Some may disagree, but your extinguisher is help put out someone elses car fire. Theirs is to help get yours put out. Your main mission is to get out and away from the car in an emergency and let the course workers do their thing. They have the training and equipment to deal with it the best.

OSP sounds like it might solve some problems. I might be close on that though. 230whp in a 2200lb car, it scoots in a straight line (makes me sad when i get beat by a lot slower cars in autox lol)

No i cant add a submarine belt to my harness. And i dont think i like that Schroth ASM. Sounds like its a cheap fix to a bigger problem. And i plan on wearing my hutchens device so that wont work anyways. Im just gonna get new 6 points for the car. Im not to sure what the rules are for mounting the sub straps though. The way they are mounted in the rally car wont work with the way the Miata is set up.

And as far as the fire extinguisher goes if in front of the passenger seat works thats where im gonna put it. Thats where one is at in the rally car and that makes reacting in a hurry nice and easy. Im sure ill have plenty more questions but ill be sure to post them up as they come up.

[GingerGSR]

Glad to help.
Make plans on getting your yearly TT tech inspection done. Bimmer Haus in Broomfield and SCR in Loveland are the two shops I know of that do them. This will make your 1st PDX/TT tech a breeze if we know your car is safe and ready to rock!

[66stang347]

Dang it i just found one more thing in the rules that i dont know if im gonna be good on or not. It says i need a front and rear tow hook that is easily acessable. Im good on the back but the front is no bueno. And with the lip on the nose with the short tires there isnt going to be any hooking up to anything underneath the car. Is this one of those things that yet again is a case by case basis? Or do i need to figure out a front tow hook situation before the first event?

[Chris_Swearingen]

http://5xracing.com/i-126686-sp-induction-systems-1990-1997-tow-hooks.html

If you get these, let me know how it works out with the intercooler. Our intercoolers use one of the four holes so I assume that you could put the tow hook against the frame and the intercooler over it. I am just not sure how strong that fourth attachement point will be since I can't remember if the intercooler mount is steel or aluminum. I imagine the other three will provide more than enough support but you never know. I have considered them for front tie downs but been counseled against it as they are supposedly for towing only.

[66stang347]

I like those, but as of right now the intercooler isnt mounted the way it was originally intended. And im gonna be getting a larger one here soon anyways. Although i wasnt planning on it before the first TT. If i need to have a front tow hook i might try this out and get the new intercooler done around this :(

[GingerGSR]

It doesn't have to be a hook per se. I bought a strap type with a ring at the end from I/O Port for $30. I got the adjustable one as I’m not sure where I’m going to attach it just yet.

Tow strap w/ring (http://www.ioportracing.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=IPRS&Product_Code=TSR&Category_Code=)

They also have ones that just have a loop at the end.

Tow strap w/loop (http://www.ioportracing.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=IPRS&Product_Code=TSL&Category_Code=)

Both are SCCA approved.

[Built-By-Bones]

hook, loop, tow point

as long as there is a way for a wrecker to hook to the car to flat tow it back to the pits, you will be good to go.

Especially important if
- you have a fast n furious front spoiler that is low to the ground
- you have mounted a front intercooler or similar that blocks access to the standard tow point
- you have an E36 BMW that spits out radiator bits every now and again

You dont want to be "that guy" that caused a delay in the race schedule because we could not flat tow your car off the track.